Draft Discussion List Guidlines/subscriber review
vcampo1 at cox.net
vcampo1 at cox.net
Mon Oct 2 21:28:24 PDT 2006
Thanks for the clarification, Wayne. I think this makes sense.
Also, I just wanted to say that I know I'm chiming in without really participating in the monthly meetings, but I teach a class on Thursday nights and can't make the meetings. I hope my participation via this list works ok for everyone.
Vicky
---- Wayne Murray <wayne at xnar.com> wrote:
> Vicky,
>
> "if someone is removed for Inflamatory speech, who will remove them? Is it
> the board?"
>
> This was the most difficult thing the committee had to answer. Thank you for
> the opportunity to explain this, if you review the proposal there are ways
> of "addressing" what is prohibited and discouraged. The committee made a
> commitment that we would be instruments of peace and promote understanding,
> through co-operation and tolerance. We decided that we would not support
> the use of coercion or force in our proposal. In the form of censorship,
> judgments or penalties and punishments. We wanted to remain a community
> discussion forum. So as neighbors we decided that we would help each other
> learn how to communicate and discuss sometimes topics that are difficult to
> do when opinions differ greatly. Taken off line, reminders, and the reply
> button that gives us a chance to give it a second thought. Individuals who
> did not act civil would be ignored and would probably stop posting, or we
> would all be able to block them and not hear them anyway. We each have the
> power to remove them from our own computers, the subject line and sender
> address enables "you" to decide that level.
>
> We do not join the list serve to make enemies, but to increase our tolerance
> and understand of one another. This will not be without its ups and downs,
> but we should all become better communicators by watching each others
> interactions, helping and learning.
>
> Force and coercion is not seen as a effective instrument when neighbors are
> having a conversation. And not what we as a committee wished to promote.
>
> Hope this answers your question and look forward to seeing you at the
> meeting on Thursday.
>
> W
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: central-city-discuss-bounces at gcna.info
> [mailto:central-city-discuss-bounces at gcna.info] On Behalf Of vcampo1 at cox.net
> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 1:14 PM
> To: central-city-discuss at gcna.info
> Subject: Re: Draft Discussion List Guidlines/subscriber review
>
> I just wanted to chime in and say thanks to all who were involved in putting
> together the listserv guidelines. I think this is great work, and I think
> the guidelines laid out here are more than adequate.
>
> I do have one obesrvation/question/suggestion: If someone has the power to
> remove postings that contain inflamatory comments, then isn't it true that
> the list is, in fact, monitored? I'm wondering if we shouldn't change the
> language in the guidelines to say that the list is monitored for inflamatory
> speech only. Also, if someone is removed for Inflamatory speech, who will
> remove them? Is it the board?
>
> That's the only thing I really see, and I'm not sure it's such a big deal.
> Again, thanks for all the time and energy that was invested in this.
>
> Vicky
>
>
> ---- thisrocks at mac.com wrote:
> > I like the phrase: "Listserve is Self Moderated"
> >
> > Thank you all for your hardwork.
> > -Aaron
> >
> > On Sep 30, 2006, at 11:00 AM, Michelle Steinberg wrote:
> >
> > Hi Maureen:
> > Just my thoughts on the issues you raise
> > I believe the phrase "all topics" makes it clear that we can share
> > information about anything that anyone in the neighborhood thinks
> > might be interesting to the others on the listserve. To limit it to
> > just Coronado issues, we would have to determine what those are, list
> > them somewhere and require that people only speak to those issues.
> > Way too restrictive, I think. There are so many things going on that
> > we can and should be sharing with one another that could impact us
> > from any number areas, it should not be limited.
> >
> > We are advocating for a self-monitored system and under the heading
> > "Moderator" we define that, It can certainly be changed to "Listserve
> > is Self Moderated"
> >
> > The whole point of this exercise was to provide neighbors with a set
> > of guidelines that they would agree to if they chose to participate
> > on the listserve. We will always retain the right and the ability
> > to remove people if we cannot stop the flow of "prohibited" language
> > such as discriminatory language or criminal behavior but we believe
> > that people will accept the guidelines, understand them and act
> > accordingly.
> >
> > Setting forth these guidelines gives participants an understanding of
> > their personal responsibility when posting without squelching the
> > free flow of good ideas, important information, and the opportunity
> > to get to know one another without a third party watching,
> > controlling and dictating how we communicate. The purpose behind the
> > creation of the guidelines was to set some broad parameters, giving
> > people a wide berth to express themselves in a positive, neighborly
> > manner.
> >
> > I don't think we have to be punitive to get people to adhere to the
> > guidelines, so providing for some sort of enforcement automatically
> > sets a negative tone. We really wanted to create something that
> > would give people the responsibility to police themselves and each
> > other, take ownership and create buy in. That's the way to
> > encouraging good behavior, not with threats and punishment.
> >
> > and something has changed, we now have written guidelines that set
> > forth our standards for use of the listserve with expectation that we
> > will all follow them.
> > Michelle
> >
> > VOTE today to change the world tomorrow.
> > REGISTER AND VOTE!!
> > www.servicearizona.com
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Maureen Rooney
> > To: central-city-discuss at gcna.info
> > Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 9:26 AM
> > Subject: Re: Draft Discussion List Guidlines/subscriber review
> >
> > For what it is (or isn't) worth, here are some specific comments on
> > the proposed guidelines:
> >
> > - "This listserv is open to all topics." Isn't the topic Coronado...
> > the neighborhood... as broad as that may be? (but as opposed to world
> > politics, just as one example)
> > - Message size: 2 mg may be fine with the server, but that's huge if
> > you are dial-up (some people still are. I think that even 1 mg would
> > be a problem for them.)
> > - The heading "moderator" is doublespeak. Sorry. But if there is no
> > moderation in the proposed guidelines, which seems to be the case,
> > then just say it. Unmoderated.
> > - I don't understand the "never post unsubscribe messages to the
> > list" rule that's suggested. How is that "unfair to others" exactly?
> > Why wouldn't we want to know that people are leaving, and why, if
> > they choose to share their reasons?
> > - "We prohibit..." and "Never" show up in several places. Yet as
> > Roobin points out, there is no way to enforce that language.
> >
> > In general, it seems that the guidelines use a lot of words to say
> > that nothing has changed. If a subscriber doesn't like what's
> > happening, they are free to leave. That hardly seems neighborly--Maureen
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Jo Clute
> > To: central-city-discuss at gcna.info
> > Sent: 9/29/2006 11:04:26 AM
> > Subject: Re: Draft Discussion List Guidlines/subscriber review
> >
> > Roobin,
> >
> > What were your specific suggestions?
> >
> > Please share those with us also..
> >
> > Everyone was invited to be on the committee.
> >
> > This proposal incorporated EVERY single suggestion we, the comittee,
> > recieved from everyone who provided input
> >
> > we also sent the proposal out and again asked for futher input. And
> > refined it again.
> >
> > The result is what we have shared with everyone in "public"
> > everything has been disclosed.
> >
> > thank you for your input........?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: roobin
> > To: Central City Discussion
> > Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 10:33 AM
> > Subject: Re: Draft Discussion List Guidlines/subscriber review
> >
> > Observations:
> > 1. This proposal is very similar to the existing system.
> > 2. The Delete key is still your only control.
> > 3. There are no provisions for enforcement.
> > 4. Some of the most strident opposition to Moderators were on this
> > guideline committee, and without enforcement self-moderation equals
> > no moderation.
> > 5. Those on the listserve any amount of time have seen many numerous
> > posts to "play nice" with one another. If past requests for self
> > moderation were unsuccessful, why would this one be?
> >
> > R.
> >
> > PS: If the committee is receiving comments on this proposal in
> > private, please share them.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Wayne Murray
> > To: Gcna-Members
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 10:02 AM
> > Subject: Draft Discussion List Guidelines/subscriber review
> >
> > Draft Proposal from Discussion List Committee for Subscriber review,
> > comment and input.
> >
> >
> >
> > History: Concerns have been raised as to the present discussion list
> > format. If you are a subscriber you are aware of these concerns.
> >
> > Action: The board of the GCNA appointed a committee to "look into
> > the problems" and recommend "solutions".
> >
> > Where we are now: Attached is a draft of the proposed format of the
> > discussion list. It is open for comment, suggestions, and changes.
> >
> >
> >
> > It is ironic that the committee was made up in part by those who were
> > viewed as being unique to the "problem". So it has been interesting
> > to discover how and why things occurred, as well as discuss
> > resolution and prevention. We spent a lot of time selecting from the
> > archive those times when "concern" may have been in order,
> > discovering patterns and coming up with solutions. We also searched
> > the internet for examples of similar discussion lists and their rules
> > and codes of conduct. Additionally, we set up an e-mail box
> > whatevercomments at cox.net to receive comments from individuals.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > The Discussion List has a unique role to play in the Coronado
> > Neighborhood. It is an entry point for new residents. A place for
> > those who can't attend or don't like meetings. A place to see if and
> >
> > how you may want to become more involved. A place to engage in
> > exciting politics, passionate issues, and information exchange. We
> > thought it very important that it operate in real time, as that is
> > what most of the threads were all about. It would be impossible to
> > operate it through delayed postings. We also thought it very
> > important that subscribers be empowered to moderate the information
> > coming into their own computers, but at the same time not moderate
> > what someone else may desire to have come into theirs. We hope that
> > along with giving you that responsibility, we have provided you with
> > the tools to customize the list to serve to your standards. Safety
> > and caution with regard to personal information, on this list serv,
> > originates and ends with you. We hope we have given you a guide for
> > that also.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > When you are reviewing the Discussion List proposal keep in mind what
> > we have preserved. It is only one part of the information resource
> > available to Coronado. Others exist, also. If you prefer a more
> > structured format we invite you to rediscover the Discussion Forum
> > at http://www.gcna.info/forum.htm as an alternate to the discussion
> > list. Or you may join the Announcement Group, if that is what you
> > would prefer. See below:
> >
> >
> >
> > Joining the Announcements Group
> >
> >
> >
> > The announcements group is a usergroup that allows you to receive
> > announcements in your email from administrators of the Forums. This
> > group can be joined voluntarily. You can also remove yourself at any
> > time.
> >
> >
> >
> > To join the group:
> >
> > . Log In to the Forum.
> >
> > . Click Usergroups from the menu at the top of the screen.
> >
> > . Under Current Memberships, select Announcements.
> >
> > . Click View Information.
> >
> > . On the following screen, click Join Group.
> >
> >
> >
> > Once you have joined, an email will go to a moderator. The moderator
> >
> > will approve your membership, and you will then be able to receive any
> >
> > announcements that are sent out by the administrator or GCNA Board
> > Member.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > The Discussion List Committee is looking for your input into this
> > proposed solution. Again the proposal is attached here as a word
> > document.
> >
> >
> >
> > It is our goal to maintain the list serve as a unique part of the
> > Diversity offered to the residents of Coronado and beyond.
> >
> >
> >
> > Discuss this online or send comments to Whatevercoments at cox.net
> >
> >
> >
> > Thank you in advance for your interest in making this a better place.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Collect responsibility...don't give it away"
> >
> >
> >
> > Submitted by Discussion List Serve Committee Members
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > --Note--
> > By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> > Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> > to the central-city-discuss list.
> >
> > --Disclaimer--
> > The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> > position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> > list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> > editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
> >
> > To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > --Note--
> > By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> > Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> > to the central-city-discuss list.
> >
> > --Disclaimer--
> > The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> > position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> > list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> > editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
> >
> > To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > --Note--
> > By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> > Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> > to the central-city-discuss list.
> >
> > --Disclaimer--
> > The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> > position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> > list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> > editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
> >
> > To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
> > _______________________________________________
> > --Note--
> > By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> > Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> > to the central-city-discuss list.
> >
> > --Disclaimer--
> > The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> > position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> > list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> > editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
> >
> > To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> --Note--
> By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> to the central-city-discuss list.
>
> --Disclaimer--
> The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
>
> To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> --Note--
> By replying to this email, you will be sending to the entire list.
> Be sure to change the recipient of the email if you do not want to post
> to the central-city-discuss list.
>
> --Disclaimer--
> The messages exchanged on this list in no way reflect the official
> position of the Greater Coronado Neighborhood association. This e-mail
> list is maintained by an outside source, with no financial tie, or
> editorial directive from the Greater Coronado Neighborhood Association.
>
> To maintain your subscription, visit http://www.gcna.info/list
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